Boy, I think I just dated myself.

I'm not sure what sort of terminology we've kept or ever used from the Salimpour clan, but right now, we only have one way of doing the Egyptian and that is with arms overhead and the aforementioned cue for the spins.

I don't have Vol 5, but we do have a Reverse Shimmy (hips are down-up-down). We don't use it very often, but its still around. ;}

Urvashi,
Being that we are on the ATS tribe run by members of FatChance, I feel compelled to preface my comments: My understanding of the facts below are mine and mine alone, and may no reflect the opinions and understanding of FatChance and Carolena, who would of course know best from their perspective how things went down over the past few decades of the evolution of this dance.

To be honest, and it may not make me very popular to say, but I think the claim that the Salimpours "invented tribal" is a debatable point, depending on what you consider "tribal". There was a lot of disdain for tribal bellydancers coming from the general direction of the Suhaila studio until they found there was a lot of money to be made by attracting this large and passionate group of dancers to the fold, and then the "we are the original tribal" claim became a regular marketing point...but I digress...

It is true that Jamila's Bal Anat was dubbed "California Tribal" (in a not altogether flattering way) by Morocco back in the day, because of its pseudo-ethnic look and feel they developed for the Ren Faire. But it was just that: a folkloric slant on regular old American cabaret bellydance. It was Jamila's combination of cabaret she learned in bits and bobs combined with stuff she "made up" (her words), dressed up in folkloric costuming done to acoustic music (since recorded music is frowned upon at Ren Faires). Dressed up in different costuming, those same dancers took many of those same dances and danced in full bedlah at the restaurants in the evenings: cabaret.

Inasmuch as what we know today as "American Tribal Style", or simply "Tribal", is a mix of ethnic/folkloric costuming elements largely performed to folkloric styled music, therein lies the connection. But the codified vocabulary, the treatment/stylization of the movements themselves, the musical interpretation, and most importantly the group improvisational choreography is tied directly to Carolena herself. So while Jamila begat Masha begat Carolena, so much changed between what Jamila created and where it went when Carolena took it in her own direction, I personally feel it is misleading to try and connect the two as the same thing. It would be far more accurate to say their work inspired tribal, or maybe heavily influenced, and definitely the vocabulary is an indisputable root system upon which tribal later grew, but was not at that time "tribal", in my opinion.

The Salimpours have been and continue to be an incredible jewel in the American Bellydance crown. They have contributed so much to the art, and the face of bellydance as we know it around the world has been shaped so much by their influences--this cannot be underestimated or understated. This is not an attempt to diminish their impact on the dance as we know it today, nor is it a judgment between tribal and cabaret as individual interpretations of bellydance--both are beautiful and valuable. I just think that the claim to have "invented tribal" is misleading, and has been somewhat overemphasized for the sake of marketing.

I was going to link you to some articles written by Jamila on the subject which were freely available on the internet before, but they are now all removed for some reason. Every link to them in every iteration is broken and missing the article. So sorry I can't direct you to more info!

So there's my take, for what it's worth.

Ladies, please, let's not let this turn into a heated discussion. There's been enough of that in the past.

Thank you.

I happen to adore Marta, and wasn't planning on posting anything more myself either, so never fear. :) We will just agree to disagree!